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Topic: Silver acetylide and other gasless explosives  (Read 3063 times)

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Offline nj_bartel

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Silver acetylide and other gasless explosives
« on: February 13, 2011, 03:19:43 PM »
What causes the report when explosives that don't release any gases detonate?  The small amount of particulate that breaks the sound barrier for a very brief time doesn't intuitively seem to be enough to account for the amount of noise produced.

Offline 408

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Re: Silver acetylide and other gasless explosives
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2011, 01:55:28 AM »
The heat of reaction (acetylides are strongly endothermic) heats the surrounding gasses, and the resultant expansion is supersonic.

I am pretty sure deflagration to detonation transition times increase in vacuum, but I forget which paper I read that in.  I think it was from 1939...

Offline nj_bartel

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Re: Silver acetylide and other gasless explosives
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2011, 07:14:57 PM »
Thanks, that makes sense.  What's the relation with DDT?  I thought that was more or less for fuel air explosives?

Offline 408

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Re: Silver acetylide and other gasless explosives
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2011, 08:51:17 AM »
DDT is a two stage process, and for primary explosives the exact mechanism is still kinda sketchy, and there are a couple schools of thought.  (bowden et al, 1930 something)

The mechanism I remember involves the gasses generated by the initial deflagration pressurize the explosive above of the combustion front, and the deflagration turns into a detonation when the compression heats adiabatically to the decomposition point.  Before the DDT, rxn propagation is by thermal conduction/convection of the hot gasses, whereas after it goes by a shock wave propagated mechanism. 

If done in vacuum, you reduce the pressure of gasses available to compress the unreacted explosive, so the DDT time is substantially increased.

The above is for shitty primary explosives such as tetrazene, styphnates, Hg fulminate etc.  The quality primaries that have no noticeable DDT lag time (ie touch a single crystal or grain of material with a match and instant detonation with no deflagration time) such as Ag nitrotetrazolate, many heavy metal azides,  etc.  For these quality initiators, I am unsure what would happen in vacuum, I suspect that the longer the DDT lag time, the greater the influence of vacuum, so these would still detonate, but I am unsure.

DDT is best understood for FAEs as gaseous modeling is easier than solid state.

Offline nj_bartel

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Re: Silver acetylide and other gasless explosives
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2011, 08:21:59 PM »
Interesting stuff, ty :)

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