[Borek]

wonder what 450 C translates into on the Kelvin scale

450 + 273 = 723

[tasmodevil44]

Here's something of some interest:The Japanese toothpaste manufacturer Sangi Co.has developed a way to synthesize biogasoline,butanol and butadiene from ethanol using the toothpaste ingredient hydroxyapatite as a catalyst.But once again,this is at high temperatures...not at anywhere near room temperature.

[tasmodevil44]

What I find interesting about hydroxyapatite is that it's a naturally occuring chemical compound of calcium found in your bones and teeth.I wonder whether or not the right frequency(s) of ultrasound and/or HF microwave could reduce the working temperature of hydroxyapatite any.Probably not by much.And it would probably still be too slow and inefficient at lower temperatures,as well as lots of other unwanted byproducts besides butanol.

[billnotgatez]

You will need the same amount of energy to convert. I suppose using room temperature with a catalyst will take a longer time. Now just finding the catalyst is the problem. One thought I was thinking about is having another organism convert the ethanol to another larger chain alcohol since chemistry seems against us.

[lutesium]

I don't think that this reaction would occur under any condition because if yes the other H s would undergo a condensation leading to 2,2-diEthylButane-1-ol.


Lutesium...

[tasmodevil44]

billnotgatez,I think you're absolutely correct.After taking an open-minded look at all kinds of catalysis(including some exotic,far-out methods like ultrasound and/or microwave assisted catalysts),the direct dimmerization of ethanol into butanol with water molecule dehydration removal at room temperature in one simple,beautiful and glorious step just does not seem very amenable to chemistry as we know it.The rules are simply working against us.

      Although the beautiful idea is so irresistably tempting you hate to give-up.It's almost like trying 20 billion times to invent a perpetual motion contraption that defies conservation of energy.

      Some type of genetically modified yeast or bacteria(which they are currently working on through a butyric acid pathway)is about the best that can be achieved at present time.Mother Nature and living cells already have several billion years worth of more chemical experience in this regard than us humans do.

[mike2011]

There are catalytic routes to produce butanol directly from ethanol.  It is a feasible process.

[billnotgatez]

@mike2011

Can you name one

[AWK]

Still promising only
http://www.google.pl/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=14&cts=1331623278350&ved=0CEwQFjADOAo&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mdpi.com%2F2073-4344%2F2%2F1%2F68%2Fpdf&ei=wPReT8nRLsjV4QSE6LXXBw&usg=AFQjCNEhSdsjhsP00-y7vhrU33kQeMclNQ&sig2=WlXkUzYUcFxy8fIiauAu5Q

[billnotgatez]

Awesome AWK
Alumina I had heard of before but this confirms
Thanks tons