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Topic: metal oxide equilibrium  (Read 12104 times)

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Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2012, 03:40:33 PM »
This is a strange question. I wish I had gone to my chemistry teacher for help in grade 12.

Offline Borek

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2012, 04:51:42 PM »
???

You are starting to see it is not that obvious.

Not that I doubt reaction is shifted to products, in general that's how oxides of alkaline earth metals behave. But I don't see how to answer this problem in terms of the chapter content.

O2- is not a bad idea, although I don't remember seeing its Kb value.
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Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2012, 12:45:41 AM »
the hydroxide Ka value is 1 so shouldn't the Kb value be the inverse of Kw ?
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 01:02:39 AM by ghostanime2001 »

Offline Borek

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2012, 04:14:51 AM »
the hydroxide Ka value is 1

Is it? Ka of 1 means quite strong acid.
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Offline Xilaim

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2012, 11:40:34 AM »
Kb - Ionization Constants MgO?

Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2012, 01:09:57 PM »
sorry not Ka, Kb

Offline Borek

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #21 on: September 21, 2012, 02:23:45 PM »
sorry not Ka, Kb

Then it is not 1, no idea where you got this value from.
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Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2012, 03:30:23 AM »
I just can't seem to figure out how they got 1022 as their Keq ? Is there any documented Ka/Kb values of strong acids or bases that is not normally given in most textbooks except for "very large". I am looking for numerical values as this would allow me to finally compare with the given value inside the worksheet.

Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2013, 07:42:31 PM »
I have bought this textbook from amazon and the book title is Chemistry: Theory and Problems Book Two from James A. Hebden. I found the acid dissociation constant for OH- at the back of the textbook. The value listed is a inequality:
KA (OH-) < 10-36

First of all, MgO is an ionic compound am I correct ? so in the presence of water, it will dissociate completely:

MgO + H2O ::equil:: Mg2+ + O2- then O2-will hydrolyze so..

O2- + H2O  ::equil:: OH- + OH- so the acid on the reactant side is water (red) and the acid on the product side is hydroxide (blue).

so using the method introduced in the uploaded sheets on the first page, finding the equilibrium constant of magnesium oxide in water would be:

Keq = Ka(H2O) / Ka(OH-) = 1 x 10-14 / < 10-36 = ??

I know that if I just calculate 10-14 / 10-36 = 1022 I get the correct answer, but how would I solve the equation with the inequality ? I know I'm very close, please guide me !!
« Last Edit: March 22, 2013, 10:46:31 PM by ghostanime2001 »

Offline Borek

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #24 on: March 23, 2013, 05:24:44 AM »
I have a feeling you are tricking yourself into believing you are solving the problem, just because the numbers seem to be close. I can only repeat what I wrote much, much earlier - I don't see how to solve the problem in terms of acid base equilibria, without seriously stretching the theory.
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Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #25 on: March 23, 2013, 12:54:38 PM »
The value reported in my last reply is the exact one written in the textbook so I am not tricking myself into making numbers work out to the correct answer. Why can't this problem be worked out using acid-base equilibria ? if you are so confident, then show me why it can't work, have you looked at the worksheets I uploaded on the first page ?

Offline Borek

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #26 on: March 23, 2013, 03:00:25 PM »
O2- doesn't exist in water solutions, just like any other base stronger than OH- doesn't exist in water solutions, so any talk about its Kb is an abuse of the Bronsted-Lowry theory. Just because you can do the calculations doesn't mean they make sense. It is not addressed at you, but at the book.
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Offline ghostanime2001

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Re: metal oxide equilibrium
« Reply #27 on: March 23, 2013, 03:12:25 PM »
Then the only explanation I can come up with is that magnesium oxide dissolves to form magnesium hydroxide and then the hydroxide ions hydrolyze to give 1 as the equilibrium constant.

MgO + H2:rarrow: Mg(OH)2

Mg(OH)2  ::equil:: Mg2+ + 2OH-

OH- + H2::equil:: H2O + OH-

Keq = Ka(reactant acid) / Ka(product acid) = Kw(H2O) / Kw(H2O) = 1

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