January 08, 2025, 12:51:15 AM
Forum Rules: Read This Before Posting


Topic: Solving complexometric exercises by thinking and by brainless plugging  (Read 2694 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Xenonman

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 55
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
Hello, all  ;D
My class is covering complexometry currently. EDTA complexes actually.
To "help us", the teacher gave an exercise I have problems with. The thing is, we were given a formula for solving them without thinking a bit. I tried a slightly more analytical way, which gives me the same base number, with a different order of magnitude. I asked the teacher about this difference, who claimed my method wrong because I calculated the Y-4 moles, which is "impossible" because the concentration is given in normality, not molarity.

All the exercises ask hardness of water in ppm of CaCO3.

The brainless method is: ppm=1000*NY-4*VY-4, ml/Vsample, ml
My method multiplies the Y-4 volume with the normal or molar concentration (reaction is 1:1, so N=M) to obtain nY^-4, which are equal to nCa^+2 and allegedly equal to nCaCO3. Said moles of CaCO3 are converted to milligrams, then divided by the sample volume in liters. This yields mg/L, also known as ppm.

I searched some other exercises and solved them with my and the other method. Again, both answers have the same base, with different orders of magnitude. My method answers what the other people who posted the other exercises, the other one doesn't:
The one I have problems with: 50 ml of a water sample are titrated with 43.6 ml of a 0.1 N EDTA solution. What is the hardness of water in ppm? My answer: 8720 ppm, using the other method I get 87.2 ppm
The other ones:
50 ml of a water sample are titrated with 25.55 ml of a 0.0149 N EDTA solution.   My answer: 761.39 ppm, the other method gives 7.6139 ppm. The answer the guy who uploaded it gave is 762 ppm.
35 ml of a water sample are titrated with 9.7 ml of a 0.01 M EDTA solution. My answer is 277.14 ppm, the other method gives 2.77. The answer the guy who uploaded it gave is 277 ppm.

As you can guess, I'm not really sure of what I am supposed to do.
Honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere.

Offline Borek

  • Mr. pH
  • Administrator
  • Deity Member
  • *
  • Posts: 27891
  • Mole Snacks: +1816/-412
  • Gender: Male
  • I am known to be occasionally wrong.
    • Chembuddy
The brainless method is: ppm=1000*NY-4*VY-4, ml/Vsample, ml

As you have mentioned ppm is typically mg/L, so this formula is wrong, as it doesn't convert from number of moles to mass.  By sheer accident, molar mass of CaCO3 is almost exactly 100 g, so it looks like all answers are off just by orders of magnitude, but for other substances you would get results looking completely off.

Your approach is perfectly correct. Nothing wrong with finding number of moles of EDTA, as its normality equals molarity in chelation (complexation) reactions. Besides, you can always use number of moles and follow exact stoichiometry of teh reaction, this is even better than just blindly using ready "formulas".
ChemBuddy chemical calculators - stoichiometry, pH, concentration, buffer preparation, titrations.info

Offline Xenonman

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 55
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
I asked with another teacher. He said I should use the analytical approach, showing the calculations step by step.
In case I get a big X after answering the test, ask the first teacher to show where the error is, instead of me challenging the previously shown formula.  This plan B is fail proof in my eyes. Is it on anyone else's?
Honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere.

Offline Borek

  • Mr. pH
  • Administrator
  • Deity Member
  • *
  • Posts: 27891
  • Mole Snacks: +1816/-412
  • Gender: Male
  • I am known to be occasionally wrong.
    • Chembuddy
Depends on the teacher. Some have no problems when you point out they are wrong, some will seek revenge.
ChemBuddy chemical calculators - stoichiometry, pH, concentration, buffer preparation, titrations.info

Sponsored Links