December 25, 2024, 04:03:42 PM
Forum Rules: Read This Before Posting


Topic: Adiabatic free expansion  (Read 4086 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline clinz63

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
Adiabatic free expansion
« on: February 12, 2016, 06:47:20 AM »
Let's say a have a piston with adiabatic walls which contains a gas. The piston has two stops. If I release the first stop against vacuum and it stops at the second stop, that means the gas has expanded against vacuum so work is zero. Heat is also zero since the walls are adiabatic. However, the state of the system changed. There is a different volume, pressure and temperature. Since internal energy is also a state function, it means it has also changed. So the summary is:
q = 0, w = 0, ΔU≠0
How?
Does this mean there some value for w since it is impossible for q. Irreversible work? Free expansion work is not equal to zero? Or is it that p, T and V changed in some way that U is the same?

Offline Vital Y

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 11
  • Mole Snacks: +0/-0
Re: Adiabatic free expansion
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2016, 10:48:18 AM »
Ideal gases obey Boyle's law so, (PV)intial = (PV)final this holds because temperature of the system hasn't changed. Since PV,T are the same, the state of the system hasn't changed. Hence ΔU = q + w = 0

Offline clinz63

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
Re: Adiabatic free expansion
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2016, 11:18:27 AM »
I didn't hold T constant.

Offline mjc123

  • Chemist
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2074
  • Mole Snacks: +302/-12
Re: Adiabatic free expansion
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2016, 11:40:19 AM »
Why should T change? No heat goes in or out, no work is done, so what should cause a change in T? Real gases expanding adiabatically cool down because they do work against the intermolecular forces. And real pistons aren't massless or frictionless. But I assume we're talking ideal here.

Offline clinz63

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
Re: Adiabatic free expansion
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2016, 11:44:52 AM »
Okay okay. :) Thanks!

Offline Enthalpy

  • Chemist
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4036
  • Mole Snacks: +304/-59
Re: Adiabatic free expansion
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2016, 03:00:57 PM »
Either you had a counter-force on the piston to limit its speed, and this has received work, or the piston accelerated, stored the work as kinetic energy, and released it in the shock.

Sponsored Links