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Topic: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?  (Read 3000 times)

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Offline IBM

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Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« on: September 25, 2018, 07:36:25 AM »
Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid and why? Could you explain it, please? I am confused

Offline wildfyr

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Re: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2018, 07:47:13 AM »
They are different but both real chemical species. Cu++ would normally be written Cu2+

Offline IBM

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Re: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2018, 01:33:13 PM »
They are different but both real chemical species. Cu++ would normally be written Cu2+
But Cu has 1 electron in 4s if we see the electrons configuration, So it should only get the charge Cu+. Is it possible that it would be cu2+ and when?

Offline Enthalpy

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Re: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2018, 02:57:08 PM »
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transition_metal

It's not even limited to transitions metals. Carbon for example can make CO and CO2, both stable.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxidation_state
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oxidation_states_of_the_elements
that table lists them all, but not even all bold figures are common.

Offline wildfyr

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Re: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2018, 03:08:17 PM »
Transition metals, lanthanides, and actinides can have several common transition states.

This is because atoms in these parts of the periodic table do not really adhere to the octet rule. One reason is because even when s electrons are the valence electrons of the 0 oxidation state for an atom, d orbital electrons can still participate in bonding.

Offline magician4

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Re: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2018, 06:15:12 PM »
But Cu has 1 electron in 4s if we see the electrons configuration, So it should only get the charge Cu+. Is it possible that it would be cu2+ and when?
sure? even with the "naked" copper atom having the configuration [Ar] 3d10 4s1  (instead of [Ar]4d93s2 , as derived from Madelung-population scheme? )

 :rarrow: if memory serves, configuration of the Cu+ - ion should be reported as [Ar]3d10 4s0 , due to the special stability of the completly filled d-level
 :rarrow: this is one of those well-known like ~ 20% exceptions from the electronical population scheme

... but I am eager to learn about new insights, if you happen to have any scientific source with respect to this


regards

Ingo
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Offline IBM

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Re: Cu+ or Cu++ Which one is valid?
« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2018, 08:49:52 PM »
Transition metals, lanthanides, and actinides can have several common transition states.

This is because atoms in these parts of the periodic table do not really adhere to the octet rule. One reason is because even when s electrons are the valence electrons of the 0 oxidation state for an atom, d orbital electrons can still participate in bonding.
'when s electrons are the valence electrons of the 0 oxidation state for an atom, d orbital electrons can still participate in bonding.' Could you simplify the point, please?

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