November 27, 2024, 11:41:29 AM
Forum Rules: Read This Before Posting


Topic: Organic Product - need some help  (Read 5232 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline kidd101

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16
  • Mole Snacks: +0/-0
Organic Product - need some help
« on: July 22, 2009, 08:13:15 PM »
hi,
I'm having problem with bezene reactions and one specific rxn i don't understand how it is wrong is this:

if you could briefly explain me why this is wrong and what would be the mechanism of the correct one so i can understand the concept of it.

thank you.

Offline nj_bartel

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1487
  • Mole Snacks: +76/-42
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2009, 09:21:57 PM »
What class of substitution reaction is that?  What's the ideal substrate for that reaction?  Why?

Offline g-bones

  • Chemist
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 197
  • Mole Snacks: +22/-7
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2009, 11:38:52 PM »
I admit that looks like an enticing answer, but there maybe a driving force for another type of reaction and product.  also look at the mechanism of what you have and see if you can identify any problems that may arrive or raise the energy of the ts

Offline Agent-X

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 76
  • Mole Snacks: +0/-0
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2009, 04:00:59 AM »
Is this an E2 reaction that creates an alkene group?
The NaOH acts as a strong base, which causes dehydrogenation?

Sorry if I'm screwing with the pedagogy here. I need practice.
Intermittent SFN member. Former RS member. Washu is the bomb.

Offline g-bones

  • Chemist
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 197
  • Mole Snacks: +22/-7
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2009, 06:41:24 PM »
I would argue that this may in fact be an E1 reaction seeing as its placing a carbocation in a tertiary carbon and is in the benzylic position.  either way elimination would create a conjugated system, which would be favorable

Offline Agent-X

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 76
  • Mole Snacks: +0/-0
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #5 on: August 06, 2009, 07:19:52 PM »
I would argue that this may in fact be an E1 reaction seeing as its placing a carbocation in a tertiary carbon and is in the benzylic position.  either way elimination would create a conjugated system, which would be favorable

I don't see that. I don't agree.

Quote
Benzylic halides undergo base catalysed dehydrohalogenation via an E2 pathway to form conjugated alkenes
source: http://www.chem.ucalgary.ca/courses/350/Carey5th/Ch11/ch11-9-4.html
Intermittent SFN member. Former RS member. Washu is the bomb.

Offline g-bones

  • Chemist
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 197
  • Mole Snacks: +22/-7
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2009, 07:03:34 PM »
I stand corrected, it looks like you are right and under basic conditions its E2.  I just saw that a benzylic carbocation would be especially stable, especially since it is tertiary too. 

Offline macman104

  • Retired Staff
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1644
  • Mole Snacks: +168/-26
  • Gender: Male
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2009, 03:26:52 AM »
It is true that the carbocation at the position would be very stable, however you are in very basic conditions, so it is not advised to draw a positive charge in the reaction mechanism.  E1 reactions are typically acidic eliminations like acid catalyzed dehydration, because the conditions would support the formation of a positive charge.

Offline ufalynn88

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 24
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
Re: Organic Product - need some help
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2009, 12:25:05 AM »
It's SN2, not E2 as there is no elimination occuring...and it isnt possible because SN2 cannot occur on tertiary carbons.

Sponsored Links