[Farlow]

I'm looking for a supplier of diethyl ether (ACS grade or purer).  So far all the manufactures I have tried fell into two categories:

1) won't ship "dangerous" solvents to individuals, or to a residential address etc.

2) will ship ethyl ether to residential address but don't carry the purity I need (more on that below)

I need a small quantity (1 liter or less).   It must be pure (99.9+ guaranteed; 0.0001% RAE ideally).   No additives or stabilizers. This is close to what I need but even purer is preferred.

Any suggestions?  Thanks in advance,

Farlow

[hmx9123]

You'll be hard pressed to find such a supplier, as diethyl ether is commonly used in illegal drug manufacture.

[Farlow]

diethyl ether is commonly used in illegal drug manufacture.

It can be used that way.  It also has at least 10,000 legal uses.  And it's sale is not restricted under state (my state) or federal law that I am aware of.  Probably more than what I need (500ml) would be required for commercial drug fabrication anyway.

Furthermore if people are able to get it illegally (for illegal purposes) then it is available somewhere.  It should be even easer since I have no need to conceal my identity or intent.  But yes, I have been hard pressed.  Thats why I'm asking for help.

[hmx9123]

It can be used that way.  It also has at least 10,000 legal uses.  And it's sale is not restricted under state (my state) or federal law that I am aware of.

You don't have to tell me.  I'm not the one you should be arguing with.  If it were up to me, one could buy diethyl ether at the hardware store.  But it's not.  Companies bow down to the pressure of the DEA and other alphabet agencies all the time and thus even if it is legal to buy certain chemicals, it is no guarantee that companies will sell to the public.  Hence, your problem.

Furthermore if people are able to get it illegally (for illegal purposes) then it is available somewhere.  It should be even easer since I have no need to conceal my identity or intent.  But yes, I have been hard pressed.  Thats why I'm asking for help.

Yes, people can get it illegally.  Usually it is stolen from a University, so that's not a good route for you.  If it isn't stolen, it is likely purchased with a business license for a fake business which is a front for drug manufacture.  On small scale, there are some shady chemical dealers that sell chemicals needed for drug manufacture to individuals.  Each of these has problems.  In one case, you're stealing.  In the second case, only a drug dealer can/would afford the time to set up a fake business (money, time, etc.), and thus making such chemicals illegal really only hurts the legitimate small user.  The last scenario, though likely to get you what you want, will provide you with the chemical, but will also get you watched and possibly unfairly/illegally prosecuted by the authorities.  It is not a good system that we have.

Next, if you tell us what your need for high purity ether is, you're more likely to get responses, as many people here probably think you're going to be making drugs.  High purity chemicals are usually only needed by research labs and thus there is not really a market for the home chemist, and thus also the suspicion of drug manufacture. 

In addition, without stabilizers, you're more likely to form peroxides which will be explosive.

I did know a guy who sold diethyl ether to the general public, but I don't remember purity and do know that he was shut down by the DEA/ATF.

[billnotgatez]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diethyl_ether

Do you have a good relationship with a local laboratory

Do you think you could safely make it yourself

[Farlow]

Thanks for the responses.

I understand the concern around drug manufacture.  I don't think I would consider applying for a business license unless I need to order ether on a regular basis.  The rest of the chemicals I use I have had no trouble ordering online.   This is the first (and possibly last) time I've run into this problem.

I don't have a relationship with a lab.   That would help.  I don't think I'm interested in attempting to make it myself, though I did consider it. 

As for what I need with it: Botanical tinctures.  There is a compound I'm attempting to isolate that so far seems insoluble in alcohol.  I want to test ether as a possible alternate.

Farl

[billnotgatez]

http://www.chemicalforums.com/index.php?board=53.0

You might try the 2 stickies at the top of that link

I have struck through those links inside the stickies that have been broken

If you find any sites for chemicals let me know

Thanks

[pantone159]

I find it a little strange (and annoying) that Et2O is so hard to get in the USA.  Supposedly, in Europe, you can buy it OTC (although not as pure as you are wanting.)

Do you really need the super-pure stuff?  The concentration of peroxide inhibitors is quite low.

[macman104]

Also, if you are trying to isolate something by dissolving it, why the high requirement for ultra-pure?  The stabilizers and such, I would imagine they are typically not highly-reactive species.  Since diethyl ether has such a low boiling point, the stabilizers should not provide such a huge inconvenience.

[Greenport]

You could make it yourself...

(NOTE: This, like many other chemistry experimentals, can be dangerous. The nature of both Diethyl ether, and Sulfuric acid are potential hazards to your safety. Don't attempt this without the proper safety measures in place! Be ready in the case of fire or toxic spill.)

Get you some 100% Ethanol solution or as close as possible anyways...(Denatured alcohol works fine unless u need super purity), and concentrated Sulfuric acid (at least 90%). Both can be found at your local hardware store or chemical supply house -- Ethanol as denatured alcohol and Sulfuric acid as drain cleaner.

You also need, for this experiment:
1 sealable glass vessel (glass bottle, for instance - preferably clear)
1 vessel for use as an ice-bath.
Ice
Water
Thermometer (optional)

Experimental:
1. Fill the larger vessel with a good amount of ice, and add some water. This is your ice-bath.
2. Place the sealable bottle into the ice-bath.
3. Add an amount of Ethanol into Vessel 1.
4. SLOWLY add drops of Sulfuric acid to Vessel 1. Add a few drops, and seal the container. Shake, repeat. Note that this reaction is exothermic and generates a good amount of heat. This is what the ice-bath is for. The reaction temperature should stay below 34.6C, and MUST stay below 130C -- otherwise Ethylene will be formed, not Diethyl ether. Generally if the acid is dripped in slowly enough, and enough ice-water is present to keep the reaction cool, this is not a problem.

-Make sure that after each addition, the bottle is re-sealed while it is cooling again. The boiling point of Diethyl ether is 34.6C (94.28F), and we don't want to lose our ether to the atmosphere.

5. When the reaction is complete, distill the contents of the cool, sealed vessel to a temperature between 35C and 78.4C (BP of Ethanol) over a spark-free electric hot plate. Or, as a safer alternative one may use hot water to distill the mixture. Utmost care must be taken not to generate any sparks/friction during this distillation - as Diethyl ether is very flammable. Collect the ether from the product vessel.

Your ether should be of high purity, with any traces of other chemicals likely being small amounts of Ethanol - that risk increasing the higher the distillation temp was. Sulfuric acid's boiling point is 290C so it is not likely that any should remain in the final product.

It would likely be hard to separate the Ethanol and Sulfuric acid since Ethanol forms an azeotrope with water at 95% conc. or so, and Sulfuric acid needs a small amount of water to prevent fuming.

One more note: If Denatured alcohol is used, it is possible that a small amount of Di-m-ethyl ether (up to 4%) will be formed as well. However, this substance is a gas at room temperature and thus should evaporate quite readily.

SAFETY NOTES:
1. Have Sodium bicarbonate (Baking soda) on hand in case any Sulfuric acid spills. In the case any spills  onto the skin, pour an excess of Sodium bicarbonate on the area immediately, THEN wash the area with water, then soap. Rinse off, and dry thoroughly. Concentrated Sulfuric acid reacts violently with water and that is a reaction you don't want on your skin.

2. Have a fire extinguisher, or at least some water, on hand in the event of a fire (which is very possible in this experiment.)

3. A gas mask or fume hood is recommended but not required. Diethyl ether is not toxic in small amounts but is intoxicating. Sulfuric acid is toxic but is not likely to become a gas during this reaction. Basically the best advice is to not breathe any fumes from a chemical reaction (ever.)

[AMDsnake20]

Would your purposes for wanting this pure diethyl ether have anything to do with morning glory seeds?

[skyjumper]

I need it as a way of isolating some oil of wintergreen. This is great! I dont feel safe storing it due to the formation of peroxides (especially without the inhibitors!)