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Topic: acid/alkali dilution  (Read 7062 times)

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Offline kenny1999

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acid/alkali dilution
« on: April 04, 2011, 10:39:53 AM »
if there exists a cup of NaOH and I dilute it with water, will the pH decrease too?


Offline DevaDevil

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2011, 11:14:55 AM »
what is pH?

if you dilute it what will happen to the concentrations of Na and OH?

What does this mean for the pH?

Offline kenny1999

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2011, 01:17:26 PM »
what is pH?

if you dilute it what will happen to the concentrations of Na and OH?

What does this mean for the pH?

pH is concentration of H+ ion

if I dilute NaOH, the molarity of OH- decreases and the equilibrium of self dissociation of water will shift to the right such that more H+ ion will form. As a result, the pH will increase. Am I right? I am not really sure.

Offline DevaDevil

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2011, 02:09:32 PM »
if I dilute NaOH, the molarity of OH- decreases and the equilibrium of self dissociation of water will shift to the right such that more H+ ion will form.

correct

As a result, the pH will increase.

pH = -log [H+]

memorize this equation!! So if the concentration of H+ increases, what happens to the pH?

Offline Borek

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2011, 04:59:23 PM »
if I dilute NaOH, the molarity of OH- decreases and the equilibrium of self dissociation of water will shift to the right such that more H+ ion will form. As a result, the pH will increase. Am I right? I am not really sure.

This is OK for solutions that are not VERY diluted. When you dilute base pH goes up, but there is a limit to how far up it can go.
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Offline DevaDevil

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2011, 05:28:30 PM »
... When you dilute base pH goes up, ...

when you dilute base, pH goes down (gets lower) you mean I presume?


Point well taken on the dilution, if you have a base, no matter how much water you add, you will not make it acidic (pH<7) - barring carbon dioxide influence.

Offline kenny1999

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2011, 12:46:18 AM »
... When you dilute base pH goes up, ...

when you dilute base, pH goes down (gets lower) you mean I presume?


Point well taken on the dilution, if you have a base, no matter how much water you add, you will not make it acidic (pH<7) - barring carbon dioxide influence.



Because of the self dissociation equilibrium of water molecules so if NaOH is diluted to some extent the self dissociation of water dominates so that H+ will remain somehow about 10^(-7) mol dm-3. however, I'd like to know what is the minimum pH that NaOH can reach on continuous dilution?

On the other hand. I really don't understand something

I would like to once ask if Carbonate + Acid => Carbon Dioxide + Water is a kind of neutralization?

According the Bronsted, carbonate receives proton to serve as base while the Acid lose a proton, this is acid-base reaction so it is a neutralization. However, some textbook states that this is NOT a neutralization because neutralization only produces salt and water. So confusing.. what is neutralization??!? Thanks!

Offline Borek

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2011, 04:42:13 AM »
... When you dilute base pH goes up, ...

when you dilute base, pH goes down (gets lower) you mean I presume?

Yes, mind slip  :-[
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Offline Borek

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Re: acid/alkali dilution
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2011, 04:46:17 AM »
Because of the self dissociation equilibrium of water molecules so if NaOH is diluted to some extent the self dissociation of water dominates so that H+ will remain somehow about 10^(-7) mol dm-3. however, I'd like to know what is the minimum pH that NaOH can reach on continuous dilution?

You wrote it already - seven is the limit.

Quote
So confusing.. what is neutralization??!?

To quote wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutralization_(chemistry)

Quote
Since a variety of definitions of acids and bases exist, a variety of reactions may be considered neutralization reactions.

There is no single answer to your question, which is most likely source of your confusion.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2011, 02:16:15 PM by Borek »
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