[CandiedMicrobe]

Hi! I am currently at a loss at how to explain nomenclature wise that in Methyl p-toluenesulfonate, the Methyl is attached to the sulfonate's negative oxygen. I can reason why it would chemically I think, but not through nomenclature alone unless I work it as a process of deduction, which I don't like to do since it feels like guesswork.

Maybe I'm remembering it wrong, but I thought it this way:

Methyl p-toluenesulfonate

Methyl- is attached to the parent but here I get a little confused. Is the parent the whole of p-toluenesulfonate? I believe the parent can't be sulfonate alone since it has no carbons, but I know the parent can't be toluene alone since I've been given a "p" prefix indicating that the benzene ring can only have 2 substituents and they have to be opposite one another (the methyl in toluene and the sulfonate), but together maybe?


I am assuming that there can only be 2 substituents on the benzene ring since its giving me one of the three possible orientation parameters (o-,m-,p-) that requires there be only 2 substituents on the ring as part of the definition. Assuming the p orientation refers only to toluene's CH3-benzene bond and the sulfonate, I assume that the extra Methyl has to go wherever it can fit without messing up the p-toluenesulfonate which would be on the negative oxygen on sulfonate.

What am I missing that explains where the Methyl belongs? Does a floating group in the front of a structural formula always go attached to the last mentioned parental subgroup named or however you word it (feel free to help me with my wording)?

  ;___; Help.

[opsomath]

Esters of acids are named as <R-group-yl> <acid-root-name>ate. For instance, phenyl acetate, or 2-fluoroethyl sulfonate.

[discodermolide]

Hi! I am currently at a loss at how to explain nomenclature wise that in Methyl p-toluenesulfonate, the Methyl is attached to the sulfonate's negative oxygen. I can reason why it would chemically I think, but not through nomenclature alone unless I work it as a process of deduction, which I don't like to do since it feels like guesswork.

Maybe I'm remembering it wrong, but I thought it this way:

Methyl p-toluenesulfonate

Methyl- is attached to the parent but here I get a little confused. Is the parent the whole of p-toluenesulfonate? I believe the parent can't be sulfonate alone since it has no carbons, but I know the parent can't be toluene alone since I've been given a "p" prefix indicating that the benzene ring can only have 2 substituents and they have to be opposite one another (the methyl in toluene and the sulfonate), but together maybe?


I am assuming that there can only be 2 substituents on the benzene ring since its giving me one of the three possible orientation parameters (o-,m-,p-) that requires there be only 2 substituents on the ring as part of the definition. Assuming the p orientation refers only to toluene's CH3-benzene bond and the sulfonate, I assume that the extra Methyl has to go wherever it can fit without messing up the p-toluenesulfonate which would be on the negative oxygen on sulfonate.

What am I missing that explains where the Methyl belongs? Does a floating group in the front of a structural formula always go attached to the last mentioned parental subgroup named or however you word it (feel free to help me with my wording)?

  ;___; Help.

It appears to be the methyl ester of p-Toluene sulfonic acid

[CandiedMicrobe]

Yeah, it is. Thanks a lot for your help opsomath. It really lead the next couple hours of brushing up pretty damn well, but now I have another question for you guys.

Can you have two acids on one benzene ring? I've been playing with <R-group-yl> <Acid-root-name>ate to help me put things together from my textbook, but now after playing with it awhile I wondered what would happen if you had two acids on one benzene ring and they were both esters. Is that even possible?


ex (I doodled this structural formula up in my notes! Not sure if its even possible!)

http://www.imgur.com/uHzXP.jpg

Butenyl Methyl p-BenzoateSulfonate?? Two things I'm not sure of how to address are ;

1. How would I designate a specific R-group to a specific ester location?
and
2. How would I designate a location for the double bond in the Pentenyl?

thank you for your help. I truly appreciate it especially as I don't have anyone to study with at the moment.

[CandiedMicrobe]

Okay, I figured out how to define the location of the double bond in Pentenyl when its a substituent of something larger. I don't remember doing a lot of it in Orgo, but I'm sure I did it.


Nomenclature -

ex:

Simple substituents on your substituent chain

When you have a saturated chain or in other words, no double bonds vs a benzene, the larger is the parent. Does this hold true for all rings besides benzene or just benzene?

(3-methylbutyl)CycloHexane

Cyclohexane is the larger so it is the parent. 3-Methylbutyl is the substituent, but IUPAC would want us to describe it within its own chain throughly because of the 3-methyl in which we label 3-methyl since we are counting away from the major substituent to this chain (the Cyclohexane). We still use -yl on butyl since its a substituent of Cyclohexane, but we define the whole chain in parentheses flush against its parent.

Double bonds on your substituent chains?

When you have an unsaturated chain (any pi bonds or higher than single bonds) it always becomes the parent in the case of benzene vs unsaturated chain. Does this hold true for all rings besides benzene or just benzene?

so for something like 3-Butenyl Benzoate, would that hold for an ester of a Benzoic Acid with a Butenyl that has a double bond at the end of its chain away from the its parent?