[bufteanu]

Hello

I don't know if this is the correct section for this post, if not please help me by moving it to the right place.

I need help with some advice.

I would like to start a small business in the chemical industry. Very small - garage type.

My idea is this :
- manufacture micro or nanopowders  of materials like boron carbide or tungsten carbide
- sell them by large distributors 

And now the questions:

- do the large distributors (like:1 Univar 2 Brenntag 3 Prinova 4 Hydrite Chemical 5 KODA Distribution Group 6 Hawkins 7 Quadra Chemicals 8 ICC Chemical 9 EMCO Chemical Distributors 10 CCC 11 The Plaza Group 12 L.V. Lomas 13 PVS Chemicals ) accept distribution contracts with small manufacturers?

- do they provide "product certification" services (for a fee)?

- are the prices from Sigma Aldrich real? I couldn't find other prices. I would like to see some from Europe. http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog/search?interface=All&term=Tungsten+Carbide&lang=en&region=RO&focus=product&N=0+220003048+219853228+219853286&mode=match%20partialmax

- could you give me some advice about what materials I should start with? I would like to start with materials that have a large market, high price / kg, and not very hazardous - no health risk.

- also if you could point me to free online information about how to manufacture it (like a recipe for pudding)

- and also some information about the proper tools : ovens etc.


All the chemical engineering books I have found on the web are too general in describing the "recipe" with clear steps to follow. Also I have found some market researches (on materials and on the manufacturing equipments) but they were to expensive to buy.

Some offtopic info, to bring more perspective to the post:
- I m not a chemist
- I m from Romania and if one wants to sell something in Western Europe is not well received because of some Romanian emigrants who do bad things. That is why I want to use the "certification" of the products by a large distributor if possible.

Thanks in advance for reading the long post

[curiouscat]

You don't know how to make it, you don't know how to sell it. You are not even sure how much it sells for. You are not a chemist, your potential scale is a "garage" and yet you'd like to service a large and high-value market.

My advice is don't get into it.

[Arkcon]

Pretty much what curiouscat: said.  You can't really get into a business with so little localized information.  However, I did want to say, if you're looking for detailed instructions on the fabrication of nanopowders and other specialized materials, those do exist.  You have to look at technical article in peer-reviewed journals that you can find in your local university library.  If you could find the methods, and you could execute them, you might be able to sell them locally.  Again, the university could help you with this.  Although I'm certain, certainly in an industrialized nation like Romania, some large companies are likely doing this sort of bulk manufacturing, for local use and global export.

[bufteanu]

First I would like to thank you guys, the two replies show that you care enough to give me such straight answers. It’s very good advice actually, I am an economist by education.

When I finished the initial post I was afraid  I would receive such answers. The reason it looks so “naive” it’s because it’s the first post and I had a lot of questions and I tried to keep my post short. Also it’s the first time that I’ve been talking about my idea.

This is not an idea I had a week ago, I’m actually dreaming of having my own business  in this domain for several years now. And I will tell you why: if I produce 100 g of tungsten carbide , 100 nm, 99%, it’s the same product with 100 g of tungsten carbide , 100 nm, 99% produced by BASF. If I were to produce 10 T-shirts, they would not be the same  product with 10 T-shirts produced by Versace or Armani.

Curioscat I think that if one wants to start a garage type business , he should start with products that have a large market, not look for niche market because it’s high risk business. If one can survive with the same margin profit percentage and equal product price as the large competitors do (or even smaller) one has a chance (at equal expenses costs percentage). The economical profile of Romania gives me some leverage though: smaller energy costs, smaller personnel costs and I dare to say smaller raw material costs; and because Romania is in the European Union I have access to a large market.

Also starting with high value / kg products, means less costs with personnel or plant size or initial investment in production equipment.


I don’t mind going bankrupt with a business or two as long as I have contact with the market and the lost money are money that I can afford to lose.

I will reformulate my questions:

- can somebody help me with a link that contains similar content to this one, but free: http://www.bccresearch.com/report/advanced-ceramics-nanoceramic-powders-nan015f.html?tab=highlight&highlightKeyword=Advanced+Ceramics+Nanoceramic+Powders

- let’s say I’m an amateur chemist who wants to produce 100 g of tungsten carbide powder , 10 μm , 99 %. What would you recommend me, should I try to produce WC by wolfram reaction with carbon at 1400 degrees C and then milling it to size, or should I try to produce it by vapor phase reaction directly at the desired size? Which is more cost effective (initial investment + production costs).

PS there is a lot to comment about “industrialized” Romania  . But that’s a different looooong post

[curiouscat]

Unfortunately I don't have any direct experience with nano-powders so can't help you much.

In a  more general sense one comment about entering a large-market business is that typically there are economies of scale in a lot of chemical products. You really have to think hard how you are going to be competitive against a larger manufacturer. Even the raw materials you buy BASF is going to get them cheaper.

One tip regarding the chemistry: Any recipes or formulae you get will rarely work as-is. Expect to do a lot of trails and optimization before you can get it right. Stuff like nanomaterials is notoriously finicky to the processing steps used. Almost to the point that it's an art.

PS. Not trying to dissuade you. But I've rarely seen a chemical process development where it turned out to be easier than it seemed at first sight. So just be realistic and factor in  large margins of safety and uncertainty.

[OC pro]

Wake up dude. You´re not a chemist. Impossible job. You think making nanopowders is easy? Better to do some illegal drugs in your garage this is way easier than producing nanopowders in 99%+ quality.
Who do you think should buy anything from you when its available from Sigma-Aldrich?

250g Ti Carbide are availabe for 634.00 EUR. This is very cheap. No chance for you to compete. It´s ridiculous.

Sorry for being this honest.

[Stepan]

Usually small companies start manufacturing in a different way. Find product that everybody needs and nobody knows how to make. Offer it on a market via Chemfinder and see the response.

Aldrich prices are closely correspond to the product quality and delivery time. You place order today, and receive a certified product tomorrow.  The wholesale price is likely 10% of the retail (Aldrich) price.

You can do product certification elsewhere, or do not do it at all - this is between you and buyer.