[Beau1k]

Sugar
I got this table from
http://wiki.chemprime.chemeddl.org/index.php/Sugar_Solution_Density:_Canning,_Maple_Syrup,_and_Pousse_Cafes
It might be viscous.

What would the viscosity be (centipoise) if we added enough sugar to make a 1.5 solution?

[Beau1k]

OK...so what about Sodium Sulphate? 

Solubility is 13.9 g/100 mL (20 °C)

SG is 2.66-2.75

Could I get this to dissolve and reach a SG of 1.8?

And at that point...what'd the ventipoise # be?

[AWK]

Never, max 1.2106 for 22 %.

[billnotgatez]

@Beau1k
As a teaching forum we encourage people to develop learning skills by giving hints and pointers.
Have you tried to find the centipoise of the items you asked about using a search engine like GOOGLE.
We understand you may have limited experience with chemistry but some work by you is also expected.

Reflect on our forum rules
Click on the link near the top center of the forum page.
Forum Rules: Read This Before Posting.
http://www.chemicalforums.com/index.php?topic=65859.0

[billnotgatez]

@Beau1k
Many of us here like to solve interesting problems like yours.
But, since we do not know the specific application we are hampered.
This has been mentioned earlier in the thread.
If for some reason you can not share the specifics, it still would be helpful with parameters.

For instance -
Can your process be heated?
That would allow greater solubility although it would increase evaporation. It could also reduce viscosity.

Try to think of other parameters that would be applicable or share the exact application for your need.

[Intanjir]

So I have looked into SPT...the viscosity is high which is a bummer.  There is also LPT it is less viscous so that's encouraging...BUT...the problem with both is they say "REACTS WITH COPPER" in my application there can be small copper dust particles so I'm wondering...what is the reaction?  What would the reaction be?

I think you might be confused a bit about viscosity numbers. A moderate concentration SPT solution would have a low viscosity of only a few centipoise and even a high concentration solution would only be around 10 cP. While these numbers are several fold higher than water you would not readily notice the difference. It would probably be better for our intuition if viscosity was reported on a logarithmic scale like decibels. Anyways, milk has a viscosity of 3 cP which is probably a bit above what SPT would have with a specific gravity of 1.45. On the other hand, a sugar solution at such a density would be a syrup with a viscosity higher by a couple orders of magnitude.

As for tungstate's incompatibility with copper presumably the copper just replaces the sodium and the resulting copper tungstate wouldn't be soluble. You would almost certainly have the same sort of problem with most non-alkali metal ions. This is not a significant problem for your application unless you somehow have large amounts of dissolved metal ions. The copper is not going to be dissolved unless your pH is acidic and I doubt that the tungstate would be soluble at acidic pH.

You would have no such problems with chlorides or nitrates. These anions are highly hydrophilic and form many deliquescent salts. I picked calcium chloride because it was deliquescent and its two ions are unequivocally benign and it can achieve an SG just barely above your stated number. Calcium nitrate would be able to get a higher SG than the chloride and while nitrate isn't something we evolved to consume in large quantities, it isn't particularly toxic.

[Beau1k]

@Beau1k
As a teaching forum we encourage people to develop learning skills by giving hints and pointers.
Have you tried to find the centipoise of the items you asked about using a search engine like GOOGLE.
We understand you may have limited experience with chemistry but some work by you is also expected.

Reflect on our forum rules
Click on the link near the top center of the forum page.
Forum Rules: Read This Before Posting.
http://www.chemicalforums.com/index.php?topic=65859.0

Yeah absolutely!  That's how I learned about centipoise in the first place 

I'm tryin...I only ask when I've exhausted my capability to calculate or understand the effects.

[Beau1k]

@Beau1k
Many of us here like to solve interesting problems like yours.
But, since we do not know the specific application we are hampered.
This has been mentioned earlier in the thread.
If for some reason you can not share the specifics, it still would be helpful with parameters.

For instance -
Can your process be heated?
That would allow greater solubility although it would increase evaporation. It could also reduce viscosity.

Try to think of other parameters that would be applicable or share the exact application for your need.

Can't share too much sorry.  Temperature would be ambient...heating would increase energy costs too much.

Basically a non-viscous solution anywhere above 1.5 would work...I figured 1.8 would be better but I think I can live with 1.5 - It must be low cost because of the loss of the mixture on the material being treated in the mixutre.

Right now I'm looking at Calcium Nitrate.  Looks promising but I cannot determine how much I can dissolve in water, what that SG would be, and then ultimately what viscosity I end up with.  These formulas elude me.

All the properties are here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium_nitrate but how to calc that into the results I'm looking for is my problem.

[Beau1k]

So I have looked into SPT...the viscosity is high which is a bummer.  There is also LPT it is less viscous so that's encouraging...BUT...the problem with both is they say "REACTS WITH COPPER" in my application there can be small copper dust particles so I'm wondering...what is the reaction?  What would the reaction be?

I think you might be confused a bit about viscosity numbers. A moderate concentration SPT solution would have a low viscosity of only a few centipoise and even a high concentration solution would only be around 10 cP. While these numbers are several fold higher than water you would not readily notice the difference. It would probably be better for our intuition if viscosity was reported on a logarithmic scale like decibels. Anyways, milk has a viscosity of 3 cP which is probably a bit above what SPT would have with a specific gravity of 1.45. On the other hand, a sugar solution at such a density would be a syrup with a viscosity higher by a couple orders of magnitude.

As for tungstate's incompatibility with copper presumably the copper just replaces the sodium and the resulting copper tungstate wouldn't be soluble. You would almost certainly have the same sort of problem with most non-alkali metal ions. This is not a significant problem for your application unless you somehow have large amounts of dissolved metal ions. The copper is not going to be dissolved unless your pH is acidic and I doubt that the tungstate would be soluble at acidic pH.

You would have no such problems with chlorides or nitrates. These anions are highly hydrophilic and form many deliquescent salts. I picked calcium chloride because it was deliquescent and its two ions are unequivocally benign and it can achieve an SG just barely above your stated number. Calcium nitrate would be able to get a higher SG than the chloride and while nitrate isn't something we evolved to consume in large quantities, it isn't particularly toxic.

For sure I'm confused  But story of my life 

Calcium Nitrate looks very promising.  Just, as stated above, need to figure out how much CAN be dissolved in water and what the SG would be, and then what the viscosity would be of that.   

[Borek]

Ca(NO₃)₂ is soluble to at least 45% w/w and such solution has a density of 1.423 g/mL.

[Beau1k]

Ca(NO₃)₂ is soluble to at least 45% w/w and such solution has a density of 1.423 g/mL.

Thanks for that!!  Can you tell me how to make this calculation?

Also...how do I determine the viscosity of this mixture at 1.423?

[Intanjir]

In general, you cannot simply calculate either solubility or density. These are determined through experiment and we normally have to look them up. However, you should be able to estimate a rough lower bound for the density of a mixture by assuming that the volume of the mixture is not larger than the sum of the volumes of the constituents. Also, for a dilute solution you might assume that the volume of the mixture is not less than the volume of the solvent and this would give you a rough upper bound. Of course your application is far from dilute so I only mentioned that for completeness.

So you might see if you can work out a lower bound for Borek's case.
BTW, assume he has there a 45%w/w solution of the tetrahydrate of calcium nitrate (which has a density of 1.9 g/cm³)

[Borek]

Ca(NO₃)₂ is soluble to at least 45% w/w and such solution has a density of 1.423 g/mL.

Thanks for that!!  Can you tell me how to make this calculation?

As Itanjir wrote - I have not calculated these, I took them from tables (built into CASC - I have nothing else at hand).

[Beau1k]

Oh.  You guys are using software...smart.  OK thanks everybody...off to the fertilizer store to do some experiments.  Wish me luck 

[marquis]

The rubber Industry typically uses zinc chloride solutions.  Sometimes HCl is needed to help solution.  These went to sp gr 2.0 easy.  Should find a reference in the astm.  Its a question of toxicity, although rinsing on removal will help a lot. 

Good luck